All of us want be happy in life and we strive to do things to get some happiness. We get married to be happy, have children to be happy, work to be happy.
Sometimes we feel happy because things work out the way we wanted it to. Sometimes our possesions makes us feel happy. But when we expierence this happiness we forget that we are getting illussioned. For example, when you get a job that you really wanted, you feel so happy and satisfied that moment but the same moment is very disappointingfor the other candidate as he wasnt successful.
After some time, you stop feeling good and start feeling dissatisfied with the job and losse the happiness. If the happiness was true then why cannt we keep expierencing it all the time? Why do we sometimes feel very happy and sometimes very depressed? Just because there exits no true happiness in this material world. Whatever we expierence as happiness is just illusion.
So next time you are happy just remember that it is not true and you are getting illusioned. When we think this way,we dont get puffed up and feel proud about our possessions/achievements. We can remain humble and thank Krisna. Also if in future, things dont go in our favour we able to take it easily and feel less sad about it. For example you feel less sad if you happened to losse the job, if you werent too happy when you got it first.
I also think, this attitude helps us prevent attatchments. Because we easily get attatched to objects that gives us happiness. So when we dont feel too happy about something, less is the attatchment to that object.
So I humbly pray to Krishna, to help us feel less happy about life and give us intelligence to understand the temporary nature of this illusioned happiness.
Haribol!
Snehal.
Love of Krishna
Indeed, everything that we do for Krishna is spiritual. Krishna is the Truth, and the perfection of life in loving service of Krishna is transcendental to the material world.
Illusioned happiness is a distraction, it is also chewing the chewed. Our natural position is loving service to Krishna, so we should think of Krishna without wasting time, and cultivate our love of Krishna. Love of Krishna is the goal of spiritual life, and it is our fulfillment.
Devotees are so peaceful because they know who they are, what the world is, who and what God is, and they know where they are going. The future is very bright for devotees, and so they have no attachment to material gain or loss.
Conscious effort
Hare Krishna!
Whatever you are saying is absolutely right....Our lives are meant to serve and Love Krishna. The sense of happiness we get by serving, pleasing and loving Krishna is divine or true happiness.
I also agree that devotees have nothing to do with material gain or loss.But all of us have to train ourselves for not getting disturbed by external or material gain or loss. We being very conditioned, get easily affected by illusion. Sometimes, maya brings distress and tries to distub us and sometimes gives so much materially that we get distracted. My point is we must understand this happiness or material gain as illusion an not get distracted and lost in it. Because distressful situations can bring us near Krishna (so Kunti Devi prays for calamities) but situations where we are very happy will always push us away from Krishna. I have never come across any story in spiritual letreture where some one became a great devotee when he was put in great amount of happiness.
Because we are conditioned we do not understand the difference between material and spiritual happiness. And when we are offered happiness by maya we tend to get lost in it because anyways we hanker for it (depending on the degree of advancement- greater the advancement lesser the hankering). And so we must make a conscious effort to let not happiness affect us.
Thank you for your comment!
Haribol,
Snehal.
Happiness/Pleasure
You're right Snehal...
The demigods in the heavenly planets desire to take birth on this planet so that they might have a chance to become Krishna conscious.
In the heavenly planets, there is so much pleasure and happiness, that it's nearly impossible for them to become free from their attachments.
This can be a pitfall for devotees too. Because we are not engaging in all the demoniac activities that cause people the most suffering, our lives can often become very pleasing in so many ways.
These ways in themselves can be a huge distraction to our spiritual advancement. I've seen this happen to me personally, so I'm speaking from experience.
It's very hard to understand the difference between being happy executing devotional service, and just being happy because you are living a "nice life" .....
These are very valuable points you've made.
Hare Krishna,
Navasi
Can you please
explain what you mean when you say that devotees can often fall away from the path of devotional service due to a happiness they are experiencing from engaging themselves in devotional service?
Thanks a lot.
Lilia
Happiness
Not because of happiness experienced from engaging in devotional service Lilia.
If you re-read what I said.... I said: "because we do not engage in demoniac activities".
I was not referring to the true happiness that comes from devotional service.
That's why I then said that it's hard for us to understand the difference between happiness the comes from a "nice life" and the happiness of devotional service.
No one (unless they are a pure devotee) is ONLY engaged in devotional service 48 hours a day. At the stage most of us are in, our Actual Devotional Service is mixed, and we are also living lives in the mode of goodness, and being "pious", which can lead to material happiness.
Devotional service never results in "falling away from the path" as you said.
Navasi
Yes, I know
that devotional service can never result in falling away from devotional service. I just wanted you to explain more what you meant. The thing is that I am not understanding is this: Persons who are engaging themselves in KC, may in fact be mixed devotees, as you say, and as such, they may be operating on the platform of the mode of goodness. But, it is only by reaching the platform of the mode of goodness that one can actually begin to engage himself in cultivating KC, because at this point, one can understand things correctly as they are.
So, if a person is feeling material happiness from the mode of goodness which is a product of them engaging themselves in devotional service to begin with (meaning that by practicing KC, one becomes elevated to this platform), then I do not see how this material happiness can lead them astray. That is all I meant. I am seeing it as just an effect of their practicing KC.
Can you explain more?
Lilia
Happiness- spiritual and material
Hare Krishna, Lilia!
It is true that by rendering devotional service we come to platform of goodness....But every activity done in goodness is not devotional service. Devotional activity is above the modeof goodness. For example, someone feeds poor people. This act performed in the mode of goodness. By doing this act the doer might feel happy and proud that he could feed say some thousand poor people. But when someone feeds those same people with pasadum, it becomes devotional service. The happiness derived by this act is because doer could feed people with prasadum of Lord that is he could distribute Lord's mercy. And because the doer just acted as an instrument of Lord to distribute His mercy, he expierences happiness. Also the doer feels happy because he has pleased and served Krishna with this act. This happiness is the true or spiritual happiness which will take the doer near Krishna. Whereas the happiness in the first case is just an illusion because the doer thinks that he has fed thousand poor people and so he is great. This happiness even though in mode of goodness brings pride and attachment which pushes the doer away from Krishna. This happiness is also material happiness because its in the mode of goodness. Anything done in any of the three modes is material because material energy is controlled by the three modes.
Hope that helps!
Haribol!
Snehal.
I understand
that devotional service is above the modes of nature. My main point was that devotional service is so powerful, that in engaging in it, I do not see how one can be lead astray. Any service done is a permanent asset to the performer. Devotional service acts to purify the heart, and since we have been associated with the material modes for an uncountable number of lifetimes, it takes time to purify our hearts. It is not an overnight affair.
So, naturally, in this purification process, it takes time. A person may be experiencing material happiness on the platform of goodness, but this doesn't mean that they have fallen away from the path or that they will fall away from the path. This same person is also experiencing spiritual happiness in the performance of their devotional service. Any individual that continues to practice devotional service, in spite of any kind of material contamination will be most assured of their success. So, how is it that anyone can really fall away from the path if they are sincere?
Devotional service is powerful! The tendency to think in terms of being fallen instead of thinking about how glorious the cultivation of devotional service is, I think can at times be detrimental to one's progress. We are all fallen, conditioned beings in this world. If we weren't fallen, we wouldn't be here. But anyone who takes to chanting the names of Krishna and to his devotional service is considered to be a sadhu.
Thinking about being fallen is good, because one has to understand this point entirely. Real understanding of this lends itself to being humble before guru, which is what is needed. One has to really understand just how fallen they are! But, at the same time, in practicing devotional service, it is a joy! It is nothing but joy at every second! Krishna says so in the BG. So, though we are fallen, we should have faith that by practicing devotional service, we will achieve the goal, in spite of our current material disqualifications. That is all that I meant by this...
So, I was attempting to understand more clearly how it is that one can fall away from the path, when I do not understand how this is possible. If one continues on with his devotional service, in spite of any material happiness one may experience, I do not see how anyone can ever be lead astray. Material happiness is insignifcant to spiritual happiness, absolutely insignifcant. And the ocean of Maya is nothing but the water contained in a calf's hoofprint for one who has the mercy of guru and Krishna. So, if we are following the instructions of guru and Krishna, then we must have faith that our desire for material happiness will soon completely be burned to ashes.
Lilia
Maya my dear Maya!
Hare Krisna, Lilia!
You are right by saying that devotional service is powerful and it purifies us and takes us near Krishna. We think we are sincerely and faithfully serving Krisna, and so Maya wishes to test our sincerity. Sometimes she will send some problem/trouble in our life and test your faith. Generally people when faced by some adverse situation losse faith in God. This way she tests our faith in Lord. Or sometimes she can trick us by giving us material happiness or pleasure. We dont understand her trick because we get lost in percieving that happiness.
How are we distracted? For example, someone has won some prize in some competition. And this was a very tough competition. He was awarded the prize before hundreds of people. All of them were standing and appluading for him. After the ceremony, each of them came to him and congragulated him. He was the centre of attraction that evening. In this case, first this person has achieved what he wanted, second he has now become famous and third he was appretiated. So obviously, he is feeling happy and top of the world. Because we are not so advanced we would (or at least someone fallen like me) like to keep thinking about that moment when the award was given, think about what people said to appretiate and also think how the life would be after being famous.
Now imagine this person has to chant 16 rounds with these thoughts or this state of happiness. Would he be able to concentrate on his chanting? Or imagine someone has to attend a Bhagwatum class in this state of mind, would he get absorbed in the class? Obvisiouly not. So as a result this person would get distracted. And devotional service done half heartedly is not as powerfull as when done full heartedly. So will this person be getting fully purified by rendering devotional service? No he will be partially getting purified depending upon how much heart he has put in that service. Thus devotional service being powerful will not be effective due to our negligence.
That is the reason why sometimes people chant for 30- 40 yrs but yet fail to advance.
Hope that answers your question.
This is my understanding, but lets hear to Navasi Mataji what she has to say. I am sure she will be able to explain it in better way.
Haribol!
Snehal.
:)
The topics of discussion and the conclusions have changed so many times here, that I have no idea what is not clear, or needs to be clear...
lol
So, I don't know what it is exactly that I might explain better....
I will say, however, that sometimes we make things more complicated than they need to be.
~ ~ ~
Devotional service doesn't produce fall downs, or distractions.
Our material desires produce those.
Anyone on this path can become distracted at any time (and or, fall down).
That does not mean they are lost eternally, but it does mean they have become "distracted"..... like I said in my first comment "huge distraction".
Material pleasure and happiness can be a huge distraction to spiritual life (like you were saying in your original post, Snehal).
Devotional service does not produce material pleasure or happiness, nor does it produce the mode of goodness.
~ ~ ~
: )
Hare Krishna,
Navasi