Pornography is a problem for so many people now days, especially with the increased production and use of it via the internet.
Someone asked me recently to address this topic and perhaps get comments from other devotees.
I think it's really important to discuss.
There are two powerful aspects here.
One, sex desire, that's been around since time immemorial. Everyone struggles with it to one degree or another, depending on the particular body and senses you have in this lifetime.
The other factor, is addiction.
So, sex, and addiction.
Pornography is an addiction. You get instant gratification, and you get addicted to that type of gratification.
It's easy, fast, instant in fact.
Our whole entire society is full of this instant kind of gratification.
Add sex to the mix, and you can see why people get addicted so easily.
So, what's the solution?
Well obviously, pray to Krishna for help, chant 16 rounds of japa everyday, and pray some more.
Other than that, like any addiction, or drive, especially sex, since that's the most powerful (Prabhupad said the whole world moves on sex desire), has to be managed, controlled by the intelligence.
Look at it this way:
Create a paper, write it down.
Say:
If I indulge in pornography, I will get a few moments/hours (whatever) of pleasure, gratification, etc...
But, then, I will feel disgusted, discouraged, confused, weak, spiritually lost, ect...
Therefore, I chose to control myself, and not indulge in the pornography, so that I can make spiritual advancement, keep my soul free of the clutches of sin, and have control over my own mind and body.
Write up your own list, make the words your own, everyone can do this, say what it is you gain by indulging.
Then, say what it is you will feel when you indulge in it. Both during and afterwards. (this is really important, we fool ourselves into thinking we only enjoy, but we need to clearly look at the consequences also).
Then, state clearly the choice you are making not to, and the reason.
Read your statement over and over and over. Especially every time you feel the urge to go to the pornography.
Realize that you have a choice here. You are making that choice every single time you look at/read the pornography.
You can just as easily make the choice not to. You have to make it conscious.
"I chose not do to this"
But, in order to do that, you have to be really clear about the REASONS why you wish to make the choice not to, or the habit, the addiction, and the strength of sex desire will pull you there repeatedly.
I hope everyone will talk about this, and give other suggestions and advice. This is a problem for lots of people, not just the person who asked me recently to address this topic.
Really, really, really, this is a problem for lots and lots of people, please don't be afraid to talk about it.
My thanks to the person who asked me to talk about it (who's asked me not to mention their name, so of course I won't).
Thank God for honesty. All Glories To Honesty.
Honesty Rules!
Hare Krishna!
Navasi
The True Meaning of Brahmacharya - the true knowledge
Namaste to All!
I would like to help out the troubled souls by directing them towards the essential knowledge and wisdom of Hinduism and Vedanta -> that which has been proven and has existed for >6500 years:
The Knowledge of Brahmacharya. I will quote authoritative sources such as Sri Swami Sivananda on the subject. www.dlshq.org/download/brahmacharya.pdf
. >So, here goes:
The sex instinct is the greatest urge in human life. Sex energy or lust is the most deep-rooted instinct in man. Sex energy entirely fills the mind, intellect, Prana, senses and the whole
body. It is the oldest of the factors that have gone into the constitution of the human being.
Why? Because the whole creation of this universe is to be kept up, God has made the sexual desire very, very powerful.
Man, with his boasted intellect, has to learn lessons from birds and animals.
Even animals have more self-control than men (most large mammal animals only cohabit once a year). It is only the so-called man who has degraded himself much by indulgence. At the heat of sexual excitement, he repeats the same ignoble act again and again.
The gratification of every worldly desire is sinful; the flesh should be the abject slave of the spirit intent upon divine things. Man was created for a life of spiritual communion with God, but he yielded to the seduction of evil demons who availed themselves of the sensuous side of his nature to draw him away from the contemplation of the divine and lead him to the earthly life.
Remember : Sensuality is inconsistent with wisdom and holiness.
In Jnana Yoga too, Dama or self-control is the foundation for the student. In the Mahabharata you will find, in the Santi Parva: “Many are the branches of Dharma, but Dama is the basis of them all’.
According to Yogic science, semen exists in a subtle form throughout the whole body. It is found in a subtle state in all the cells of the body. It is withdrawn and elaborated into a gross form in the sexual organ under the influence of the sexual will and sexual excitement.
Veerya(semen) is the quintessence of blood. One drop of semen is manufactured out of forty drops of blood.
Even the Chinese know of the valuable nature of semen -> Chinese medicine place huge emphasis on a form of energy called 精 ("Jing") - denoting "essence". "Jing" is sexual energy and is considered to dissipate with ejaculation so masturbation is considered "energy suicide" by them.
‘Brahman’ is the Supreme Being; ‘Charya’ is conduct, or behaviour. How God behaves—that is called Brahmacharya, finally.
All this talk about brahmacharya must not give us the impression that in Hinduism and in the Hindu religion, sex has no place and celibacy is the only thing that is insisted upon and lauded as the highest virtue. That would be a mistake, a misconception.
In the Grihasthashrama (householders’ life - -> what we called married people with families) the exercise of sex life is regarded as sacred, and elaborate rules and regulations have been drawn up for it. A great deal of advice, guidance and instructions have been given for the second ashrama, where it becomes not only a right and permitted but is elevated to the sacred duty of the householder.
Hence, the rightful nature of sex as procreation for the proper (read proper) advancement of the human species is given the righteous status.
So Hinduism is not anti-sex or a negation of the human nature and human function.
An important thing to know:
Mahatma Gandhi said that no attempt to keep oneself under control and in mastery only from the point of view of one’s carnal passions or physical appetites will ever be successful unless simultaneously one tries to keep all one’s senses under control.
So, what you have to do to attain a life of REAL and ACTUAL Satisfaction & Happiness is to regulate your senses and ultimately DESTROY the evil forces of LUST, ANGER and EGO through the process of submitting ourselves to Bhagwan Krishna and being His humble devotees.
Jai Sri Krishna!
Hey Brahma Vishnu Mahesh!
Restriction of Desires
Restriction of desires will never work. The only thing that will make lower desires cease is the acquisition of higher desire 'spiritual'.
Lower desires and the force of desire in general is part of our being, and cannot be removed! This force cannot be stopped, blocked or restricted but can only be TRANSFORMED or switched over to a higher spiritual desire.
The will of desire is an aspect of the soul - how can someone restrict an aspect of their soul, no can do - and actually trying to do so is totally against our purpose here. Why are we here?
Part of why we are here is to experience this lower desire and 'to see how it is different from spirituality'. WE NEED TO DISCOVER AND DESIRE SPIRITUALITY WITHOUT COERCION, and to establish an intention that is above reason.
This is the condition that corrects the ego as well (the ego also an inseparable part of our being), which renders lower desires in the right manner.
Haribol
Excellently written article,
Excellently written article, if only all bloggers offered the same content as you, the internet would be a much better place. Please keep it up! Cheers.
Dont think of Porn ,Think of Krishna,Srila Prabhpad ki jay
PAMHO.AGTSP,GURUGAURANGA JAYATE,
OM NAMO BHAGAVATE VASUDEVAYA,
satatam kirtayanto mam---B.Gita 9.14
ALWAYS chanting My glories,endeavoring with great determination,bowing down before Me ,these great souls perpetually worship Me with devotion.
Ananyas cintayantomam---B.Gita 9.22
But those who always worship Me with exclusive devotion,meditating on My transcendental form-to them I carry what they lack,and I preserve what they have
mac-cittah sarva durgani----B.Gita18.58
If you become conscious of me ,you will pass over all the obstacles of conditioned life by My grace .If however,you do not work in such consciousness but act through false ego,not hearing me ,you will be lost.
So as trying to become devotees of Krishna , we must engage ourselves in devotional service , by hearing ,chanting, etc .we must engage in all such devotional activities so that we always think of serving Krishna.In what way we can serve Him next or all time .
When we analyse,we understand that our desire to watch porn is stronger than our desire to serve Krishna.So we watch porn The desire is within our mind .
At present our mind is in a diseased condition .Therefore the mind don’t want to think of Krishna .It thinks of pornograph and so many other things .A thought becomes an action ,and an action becomes a deed ,and a deed done continuously for many days becomes a habbit and then we become addict to it. So we have to change our thinking .
No matter even if you are seeing porn ,THINK OF HIM ALWAYS you start chanting and think of Krishna,Pray honestly ,”O Krishna I am doing a wrong thing ,I am unable to get out of this , please help me , please forgive me .” First one must desire that he wants to serve Krishna ,meditate on Krishna.Then Krishna will sanction that .Krishna is so merciful that He sanctions all desires .Because one desire is there to see porn ,So He is sanctioning that .
Therefore we must strongly desire and think AND STRONGLY DETERMINE of serving Krishna always .For the diseased mind thinking of Krishna will be bitter in taste .Just like a person having jaundice will taste sugarcandy very bitter.The medicine for jaundice is sugarcandy.So if he keeps on taking sugarcandy ,he will be free from jaundice .When he is free from jaundice ,the same sugarcandy will taste sweet for him .Similarly when our mind is free from disease,we will taste the sweetness of Krishna .Then it becomes Krishna amritam.
So let us all pray to Krishna for those who are suffering from this weakness and disease .
“ O Krishna please save us all and engage all of us in your service “
So dear prabhus and mataji s please try your best to change your thinking.It is the thinking ,that which is leading you to the other side .No matter if you fail .Even while you are watching porn think of Krishna .I am sure you will win ,if you have a strong desire to win .So strengthen your desire to win .Dont care for the failures,strengthen your desire for Krishna s service ,Try so many time you will win . We will also pray for your success.This is what I learned from Prabhupad.Hope this will help all those who are suffering from pornograph.
In the service of Krishna ,
An insignificant beggar,
Vibhooshankrishnadas.
Some Thoughts...
Well, true prabhu, what you've said...
However, some people don't yet have a strong enough desire to serve Krishna to free them from certain addictions.
Until that desire is strong enough, then these addictions can certainly be interfering with developing a stronger desire to devote themselves to Krishna.
So, in the meantime, in order to at least get the addiction under control to a degree that the person can at least follow the process of Bhakti, I was suggesting some simple, basic behavior modification techniques that help to deal with habits of any kind at all that someone wants to change.
It's simply behavior modification, and someone who can't even follow the process of Krishna consciousness, due to their addiction to porn might benefit, I thought.
After all, it's not really enough to just "pray".... we have to make conscious efforts to overcome our obstacles on this path.
Srila Prabhupad has also said many times "God helps those who help themselves".
So, what ever method a person uses, the main thing is to remove yourself enough from this addiction to be able to at least follow the process by which we will actually develop a strong determination to be serving Krishna and remembering Him in all ways, and at all times.
I figure if someone is that Krishna conscious and determined to remember Krishna, they wouldn't be having a problem with porn in the first place, so I felt maybe they needed some help getting to the point of being able to even follow the process.
I liked you comments :)
Just wanted to explain why I'm referring to the use of basic behavior modification techniques.
Hare Krishna,
Navasi
The power of mantra and blessings of Guru
PAMHO,AGTSP,SRI GURU GAURANGA JAYATE,
OM NAMO BHAGAVATE VASUDEVAYA,
Hare krishna Mataji ,I just told my experience .When i met my siksha Guru H.G. Sarvaiswaryadas Prabhu, I told him that i was having all the bad habbits which he could find in the world .i was a chain smoker ,drunkard and everything.He just told me
"never mind you simply chant .And what ever you do ,dont stop chanting."
In the beginning I did all kind of nonsense like smoking and chanting ,drinking and chanting etc etc.I just kept on chanting and chanting at last all my bad habbits came to an end .
When I was doing some wrong things also I was thinking of Krishna .I was thinking that O krishna now i am doing a wrong thing ,My mind says i want that .I understand that you dont like that .I am helpless .please forgive me this time , i will try to win next time please give me strength next time . Finally HE gave me that strength That all my habits stopped .This is a wonder even now for my friends and relatives.So this is the mercy of guru and power of mantra which i realised.thank you ,
in the service of Krishna,
an insignificant begger,
vibhooshankrishnadas.
Eating Meat And Chanting
Dear Pitaji,
Well, I'm very happy to hear that it has worked out that way for you.
I'm think for some people, say, if they can't stop eating meat, for example...
Well, we could say, "just don't worry about it, just chant, and keep eating your meat, just chant also" and that would be one way, or we could say "well here, look at this video of the slaughterhouse" .... "see how these cows suffer"....
Perhaps that might help them stop eating meat.
The sooner they stop, the more effective their chanting will be.
That's what I'm trying to say.
I certainly wasn't saying that anyone should stop chanting until they got control of themselves, just trying to offer additional help, similar to showing someone a video of a slaughterhouse might help (only another way of helping).
Navasi
Guru's blessings
You are right mataji, people are different one way may not suit all.I just gave one way ,how it changed me .when different ways are given ,one can try one way or other.
Any way Krishna's name has its power ,and it will show its power.Those who are totally in ingnorance ,find difficult to understand anything spiritual or anything connected with Krishna ,for them ,Guru's blessings and krishna's name is the only way.
an insignificant beggar.
True
Yes, I have very much noticed what you are saying.
There is so much ignorance and difficulty to understand spiritual things.
It's very sad and unfortunate.
I think you are right, all we can do is pray to Srila Prabhupad and Krishna that everyone will take shelter of the Holy Name (and a proper guru) and thus come to understand things.
Otherwise, it just makes me too sad. :( :( :(
Navasi
yep ...
yep...defineatly... This is exactly why i became celibate....
Celibacy
Very good Manuji, that is going to help you so much in your Krishna consciousness.
Celibacy is one of the most important things, and it helps us with out spiritual life so much.
It makes no difference who you are, if you are a man, or a woman, married or unmarried, Prabhupad still emphasized celibacy for every one of us.
There's a reason for everything he tells us. If it was not important, he would not have stressed it so much.
So, you're doing great dear, good job!
Nice to have you comment here. :)
Navasi
nice!
thanx mother! i think i will definetely stay celibate! thats cool 2 no!
Confession
Thank you to all the wonderful devotees here for guiding so nicely.
However I would like to confess that it is not me who is suffering from this problem but someone related very close to me. Since he did not have the time to write here I wrote on his behalf and after making him read replies and taking his fresh queries I put fresh queries here. Thanks to all.
Please help me
Hare Krishna. You are quite right. I had not realized since the past years that I was addicted to porn and masturbating. Only when I tried leaving it recently I realized that I am actually an addict.
I am finding it impossible to leave porn and masturbating. I don't even understand why we need to leave it. The reason I am saying this is because recently I left it for 10 days continuously and my mind became so frustrated that 24 hrs I was forced to think of porn and masturbating and due to this I could not even chant properly, my entire spiritual life got ruined. Then after 10 days when I masturbated my entire senses got calmed down and I could finally think of spiritual life again. After this experience I have realized that at least in my case leaving porn and masturbating is actually ruining my spiritual life as the frustrated senses don't allow me to live. I guess I am completely trapped in this prison of Maya.
ONS.
never give up
you cannot force yourself to stop bad habits, you can only replace them with a Higher Taste.
the Lord knows what's in your heart, and if you are sincere...cry out to Him for his mercy, to help you understand your situation...for only He can really help you. trust Him, believe in Him. starting with hearing, chanting, and remembering Him, and befriending Him...accepting Him. Krishna is our best friend, and ever well-wisher.
whatever your situation, don't let guilt deter you. the Lord loves you and is most kind, and forgiving of the sincere. the more you approach Him, the more He reciprocates. and the more positive experiences you have with Him, the more you lose your taste for "empty" bad habits. no matter what...never give up on Krishna!
don't worry!
My dear prabhu/ mataji
don't worry!
I was recently reading srila prabhupada's book the perfection of yoga. He retells the story of visvamitra muni. One day he was performing auserities . King indra saw him and thought that the muni was trying to take away his position.he sent a girl named menaka to allure him sexually. The muni was aware of her presence by the sound of her bangles ,looked up and was captivated. as a result shankuntala was born. The muni lamented saying that he was trying to get spiritual knowledge and had failed. However he decided to go on with his spiritual life. This should be your resolve. Even a greatsagesuch as visvamitra muni could fall down.Such things such as masurbating and porn don't worry about it. They should not be causes 4 despair.I agree with eternal musers tips on how to control sex desires. And lastly just chant as much as possible...because the more you chant the closer you get to krishna.
Chin Up Prabhu.......All Is Not Lost!
Hare Krishna ONS Prabhu!
I think I understand your position. You wish to leave indulging in pornography but by the force of habit, you are again and again drawn into it. If you abstain from it, after a few days, you start experiencing a ‘withdrawal’ like phenomenon, much like a habitual smoker or an alcoholic who after a few days of abstinence, feels that overwhelming urge to indulge in a smoke or a drink.
But all is not lost. I have gone through what you have, and come out of it. I can offer you some suggestions.
Before I suggest any solutions, I wish to assure you that you are not alone. I know of many, many essentially GOOD NATURED boys (and even some girls!) who have fallen prey to this scourge called pornography. So don't condemn or criticise yourself. We are all spiritually weak, so these things are bound to happen. Porn is like a dangerous narcotic drug. It makes you crave for more and more ('I think I'll just see that one last gallery/movie-clip before I go to sleep') And that gallery/movie-clip is never the last one. THAT'S how powerfully malignant porn is.
Besides, the media that we're exposed to, continually reinforces the idea that one should be sexually overt and bold and keep on trying to look, smell, feel and behave more and more sexually attractive. Add to that the so-called Medical Experts and Psychological Counselors, who claim that pornography actually is 'healthy' and can 'enrich' one's relationships. Peer pressure is the last nail in the coffin where watching porn is the 'done' thing making one look 'macho' or 'virile'. Announce that you don't watch porn and then hear your friends tease you about your alleged 'mental abnormality/ impotency/ gay tendency' and a host of other conclusions that their wild imagination can afford them. In fact it's a wonder how everyone ISN'T addicted to porn. Not surprisingly, I've heard that 30 percent of the Internet is devoted to pornography.
But you can change that. It starts with the recognition of the problem and admission to yourself that you have that problem; the desire to watch porn. And you have done that. That's the first step.
Then comes the second step. The Will to do something about it. Your email indicates that you have that as well.
Then the Means to do it. I suggest the following 'techniques' if I can call them that.
1. Prayer: Start and end your day (everyday) with a prayer to Krishna, one said from the bottom of the heart, with INTENSE feeling (clench your teeth and squeeze your eyes and fists tightly if you have to!) Tell (rather, plead with) Krishna that you want to leave this bad habit and you desperately need His help and that you cannot manage on your own. Krishna is your BEST FRIEND. He WILL listen, I promise you.
2. Chanting: The best vaccination I've known for all negative behaviour. Regular chanting will increase your awareness, you will be able to sense this 'craving' every time it appears in your mind and then you can nip it in the bud before it builds up and overcomes you. Your mind can concentrate on only one thing at a time. So if you have forced it to concentrate upon the Holy syllables of the Mahamantra, chances are less that you will be distracted by the unwanted desire.
3. Vaishnava Association. Seek out the association of Devotees, especially Advanced Devotees online or at your local Temple. Their company will reinforce desirable thoughts and destroy all the negative ones in your mind. Advanced Devotees will also be to guide you on how to eliminate this desire for porn. (in fact, whenever you're online and your fingers are itching to type out that 'free-porn-for-you' type website, force yourself to click that bookmark that says www.krishna.com and read a blog or a forum topic or few pages from the scriptures (or just gaze at one of the innumerable pictures of Krishna on the website).
4. Read the Bhagavad Gita As It Is: Everyday, at least 5-10 verses. And throughout the day, ruminate upon them. It works like magic, I tell you!
5. Create a conducive environment. Throw away any book/magazines that you may have. Even those which offer 'mild' or 'soft' porn as a content (e.g. pics of models in bikinis etc.) Avoid films and TV programs that have similar content. Avoid those people who call themselves friends and want to make you indulge in porn. Do it discreetly though, since you may require their association for your classes/ studies/ projects. You can always decline an invitation for a 'porn-flick party' mentioning some prior engagement or something. In your room let some Kirtans continuously play in the background. (Get them at your local temple. I've uploaded some to http://www.esnips.com/web/eternalmuser-Music You can download the same from there. It's difficult to think about viewing porn when some advanced Devotee is singing Lord Krishna's Holy Name in a melodious voice ;-)
6. Internet Porn- Lock up the room and throw away the key. Install a 'child-protection' software like Cyber-patrol or Net-nanny that will prevent your browser from opening pornographic web-sites. Keep a password that you can never memorize e.g. b8hszor63d94jnzxe937g6j38sfjeidk Write it down (in case you need to change it), but keep it in a place where you will find it difficult or tiresome to access it on a regular basis (e.g. in a Devotee friend's cupboard, in his house).
You may not succeed in one day. But even if you stumble, forgive yourself, for you are only human. And a conditioned one. Like myself and many others. But get back on your feet. And persevere, relentlessly. Krishna is limitlessly kind. He ALWAYS awards success to those who wish to achieve it.
Hope my suggestions help.
One last word of caution. Even if you succeed in your mission, always remain alert in the future. Till we become true Devotees ourselves, remember that danger of this foul desire always exists around us, threatening to pounce upon us. But here onwards the danger will lose some of its teeth. For now, you possess the armour of Krishna Consciousness!
Haribol!!
Your eternal servant,
Eternal Muser
"Announce that you don't
"Announce that you don't watch porn and then hear your friends tease you about your alleged 'mental abnormality/ impotency/ gay tendency' and a host of other conclusions that their wild imagination can afford them."
ahahahaha
god that gave me a good laugh....been there. oh the memories of 9th grade school camp...
but seriously, this is an excellent post. my hearty congratulations to you for posting up something so nice. Haribol to you prabhuji.
Very Nice
This is very nice Eternal Muser,
all your advice is very sound and good.
Navasi
Jaya
Hare Krishna. This is simply amazing. Thank you so much. I am sure I will now definitely be able to control the urge. I also loved your idea about locking the porn sites and putting a difficult password so that I just forget the password. You are a genius. Thank you so much.
ONS.
Hariiiiiiiiiiiiiii..............Bol!
All credits to HIM Prabhuji, All credits to HIM! For only someone like HIM can prompt a fool like me to conceive such ideas........
Have the WILL and HE will tell you the WAY!
Always....
Your eternal servant,
Eternal Muser
Hari Bol
Hare Krishna. Thank you to both HIM and YOU.
ONS.
Traps
Hare Krishna, Dear ONS,
First of all, I think you need to look at one very essential thing you said:
"I don't even understand why we need to leave it."
This is a the greatest detriment I see to your progress. How can you possibly begin to fight such a strong urge and addiction when you are not beginning from the premise of understanding why you need to leave it.
After you understand why, then you also need to be convinced that you actually want to.
You have neither one of those factors on your side.
You not only don't understand why, you also believe that it is somehow helpful to you to engage in these activities.
So, you don't stand a chance as long as you feel that way. I would suggest working on the reasons.
If you want to get control of your senses, keeping on giving in to them will get you no where. But, this is something that you personally have to decide. Right now, you think it helps you chant to engage in these activities.
Breaking the regulative principles does not help someone chant, or make spiritual advancement. You have to see that based on acceptance of Srila Prabhupad's instructions if nothing else.
You say "please help me" .... well, something is making you feel you need help. If you think you chant better after reading pornography and masturbating, then why do you ask for help?
If you really want help, then something is causing you to want it, there is some feeling in you that these things are not really as helpful as you say they are.
You need to look closer at that I think. You have a strong conflict of interest it seems to me.
Navasi
Sorry
Hare Krishna. I am sorry for saying that I don't understand the reason for leaving porn. I actually meant that though Swami Prabhupad said that we should leave all this only then we could benefit from it still I am not being able to leave it nor I am being able to benefit by leaving it. I understand this is because I am too sinful and contaminated and I also understand that continuing with porn and spiritual life together is like adding fuel and water together in fire. I meant that I want to leave it but I just cannot leave it and I sincerely need your help as I feel trapped by maya.
ONS.
Invitations
Hello ONS,
I was reading this thread and became concerned of what you said about your spiritual life being ruined because you gave into a sexual desire. I don't believe that is true! Maybe unhappy with yourself and with your will power, but not 'ruin' - you are fighting one of the biggest fights of all! Sexual urges are programmed into our DNA, from the molecular level of what composes our physical bodies, throughout our whole physical being.
I have found that it is very helpful to greater understand the mechanics of this process rather than feeling shame and hurt and weakness because of it. The dichotomy of these feelings of weakness as a result of experiencing sexual urges is that, the physical sensations that you are feeling are part of the life force that actually keeps you alive - it is your physical vitality - if you try to kill it, and you are successful in killing it, you will die! Because it is an expression of the very life force of your physical embodiment, and its reminding you that you have life as a body, and its reminding you that you are a human being, and this is how human beings feel - so far there is no conflict with spirituality!
The potential conflict with spirituality is HOW you deal with it. This is one of the great challenges of being human -and- being spirit at the same time! This by the way, if you remember, was one of the reasons we were created. Man- the creature that has the ability to vacillate freely between the material and spiritual worlds, with free will, master of his own destiny with unlimited boundary. But we need to master our senses in this world in order to evolve.
I have found that some knowledge of Auyurveda is very useful in the fight to master the senses. Understanding your constitutional type and the foods and activities that have a stimulating or aphrodisiac affect on you, based on your constitution. This is helpful to understand, and if practiced can cut your physical sensation of sexual urge in half!!
The other aspect of control is the thought process- During the release of natural sex hormones in the body there are physiological changes within the metabolism that increase the flow and distribution of cerebrospinal fluid which exerts pressure on the cortex, and reduces a persons higher cognitive abilities, at the same time these hormones affect the adrenal glands making them secrete adrenal hormones, which increases heart rate and and stimulates the thyroid to produce thyroid hormone which peaks your whole system, and puts you in the mode of physical action which increases the release of endorphins and brain chemicals that give the sensation of being invincible and feeling little or no pain - which in turn lowers a persons higher cognitive abilities even more!!!
So the mind during this state is not doing high math or tuning into subtle energies of contemplation or meditation. In a Tamasic state.
Ayurveda says 'Like increases Like' - I have found that (if you have the vitality) the body is always ready and willing to go for a ride! But its the thought that gives the body the invitation, once the thought gives the body the invitation the physical process of hormone release begins and you feel a rush! That rush feeling tells your mind that it wants to go, and that process begins to 'shut down' your ability to reason -- This is where I have found the greatest problem can be, because right at this point of metabolic acceleration is when the ability to 'reason' is hindered by the actual reduction in higher cognitive function that is actually induced by the process its self. This gives the sensation of being 'out of control' because its like a loop. Its becomes a closed loop between mind and body where one increases the other and will not stop.
I have found that the best remedy to this is 'DON'T PUT OUT THE INVITATION' this is more than 'not thinking about it' there is a difference of thinking about it to give an invitation to your body to become engaged!
Although thinking about sex in general is tamasic in nature and is a conflict with spirituality, as you know.
I have found that a combo of Ayurvedic knowledge, the regulatory principals and Mahamantra is the key - actually, for me Mahamantra is key, this keeps the mind 'out of' the tamasic state, and the process of tamasic actions cannot get a foothold to proliferate!
Hare Krishna -
Illusion
Maha Vishnu, this is all total illusion.
Studying the Ayurveda will never get anyone free from sex desire.
Sex desire is the force that keeps us in the material world, there is nothing good or wonderful about it.
The one thing you said that is accurate is:
"Because it is an expression of the very life force of your physical embodiment, and its reminding you that you have life as a body, and its reminding you that you are a human being, and this is how human beings feel -"
Yep, that's true for sure, and that's the very reason we avoid it, because it reminds us continually that we are this body, over and over, we have a body, we are a body, etc...
We're attempting to remember Krishna here.... that's the idea.
I could say a whole lot more, but I don't have time right now.
Hare Krishna
Navasi
Getting Free
"Studying the Ayurveda will never get anyone free from sex desire."
The object is not to get free, that was never the case.
The object is how to handle - and how to help one thru this difficult thing with vedic knowledge!
Stating that this promotes remembering the body is strange??
>> How about, We are here right now in this world -and- LEARN HOW TO DEAL WITH IT! And practice spirituallity at the same time!!!!!!!
Hari Bol
The Object
Well Maha Vishnu, maybe for you the object was never getting free from sex desire, but it sure is for most devotees.
Speaking for myself alone, it certainly is.
There's all kinds of vedic knowledge available, that's for sure, and it can "help one thru this difficult thing" as you put it.
Well, we could read the Kama Sutra, and have lots of great sex within marriage... that's vedic knowledge also.... but it won't help us go Back To Godhead.
We could practice Tantra Yoga, that's also Vedic... where will that lead?
So, since you have a different goal, not getting free from sex desire, just "managing it nicely" I can see why you'd say these things.
I'm only telling you what Prabhupad says about it. This is what he says about it's effect on keeping us in the material world.
He is the one who says it promotes bodily identification, so if you think it's strange, then maybe you will think the path of Krishna consciousness is strange as well.
That's up to you, but the idea we're addressing here is getting free from sex desire, (yes, keeping it under control along the way helps us with that), but ultimately, we have to do things that get us free from it.
It's a complex and difficult subject, and it's a struggle for everyone, unless they are a Pure Devotee, so for you to say that if we just study the Ayurveda, everything will be "peachy" is just not the path of Krishna consciousness.
Navasi
understanding
Ayurveda is not illusion! Ayurveda is authentic Vedic text.
Please show me where Shrila Prabupada stated this in his teachings ???
Ayurveda has been given to us by the lord to heal us and to help us undersand ourselfs!
Please explain why you have such a reaction to hearing such things???
Thank you.
Ayurveda
I never said the Ayurveda was illusion, I said that what you were presenting was illusion.
It's illusion because you think that by studying the Ayurveda you can control, manage, come to terms with, sex desire, or something along those lines.
So, maybe you can reduce your physical drive in this particular body somewhat, that's cool... great.
The only problem comes in when you forget to include the fact that this is the force that keeps us in the material world.
It's the manifestation of our desire to enjoy separately from Krishna.
So, even if you decrease the physical urge, unless you purify yourself in the fire of Krishna consciousness, what have you really accomplished?
I have never found any Ayurvedic text that will eliminate the desire to enjoy sex. So, what remedy do you have for that?
What's going to remove the desire for sex?
Controlling it in various ways, is like keeping a blazing forest fire "under control". Well, good it doesn't burn down the whole world, but much better to PUT IT OUT.
Krishna consciousness is the process of "putting it out", not keeping it under control.
Keeping it "under control" is another way of "maintaining it"...
meaning, as long as it's manageable, what need is there of removing it?
So, teaching someone only how to "manage it", is another way of teaching them to "maintain it".
Therefore, I said it was "illusion".
Navasi
Understanding 02
navasi,
I have not presented any illusion in the post - If you interpret it that way then I think your missing the point I was making.
"--So, teaching someone only how to "manage it", is another way of teaching them to "maintain it". --"
The link to manage and maintain takes what I said out of context.
I have no time or motive to continue these responses to judgmental interpretations of my statements.
Haribol
Judgmental Interpretations
I'm sorry you feel I've been judgmental Maha Vishnu.
I feel you were making judgmental interpretations of my statements also.
I'm only saying how things seem to me, the same as you are saying how things seem to you.
You and I keep having this problem over and over. We seem to disagree on a lot of things. Lots of times I have felt you didn't understand the point I was making, and you also feel that I don't understand your points.
Some people just think so differently it's hard to "connect" on anything I guess.
Navasi
Ayurveda
Hare Krishna. Thank you for such an intelligent reply. From your talks it seems that you are an ayurvedic doctor, if yes then I request you to recommend me some ayurvedic medicines to free myself from this urge as I cannot afford to go to an ayurvedic doctor.
Also you said that you benefit by chanting but in my opinion you are benefiting as you have reached the stage of anurag. I have yet not reached the stage of anurag. This is the reason I don't have a taste for chanting and am thus not being able to benefit by chanting. More details about anurag is on www.japagroup.blogspot.com a site by Rasa Rasika.
ONS.
Afford
Hello ONS,
You dont need to see a doctor to understand your constitution.
The level of understanding you need in order to help yourself with Ayurvedic information, is very easy to understand in laymans terms, and is free or almost free. There are many websites that teach the basic concepts and elementary books that are low cost, where you can learn enough on you own, and put the info to work.
"I request you to recommend me some ayurvedic medicines to free myself from this urge"
Its not a medicine you need - its the 'understanding' of whats going on when you go thru this repeating cycle, and the unerstaning of how to help yourself get thru it and to make it easier for you, and to help you make it work the way you wish.
Haribol
Got it
Hare Krishna. Thanks a lot. I got what you are saying and I will be try to accumulate some information on the same.
ONS.
From the acaryas
Nice points given by various devotees especially by Eternalmuser. I think we should take help whatever help from wherever to deal with this problem. I came across the following recently and thought it may be relevant to share it here.
Eight aspects of brahmacarya, ( by Sridhar Swami, the Bhagavatam commentator. Also quoted in Daksha Smriti).
(1) Smaranam - One should not think of the opposite sex. One should think of Krishna and His service as given by the spiritual master. Memorize favorite passages or verses from the scriptures.
(2) kirtanam - One should not talk of sex life. (Prajalpa) One should talk of Krishna and discuss ones realizations with one’s friends, other brahmacari’s. (Practice gravity).
(3) kelih- Don’t (play) or dally with the opposite sex, (even if it is your service to deal with them, try to minimize it) . ‘Avyartha-kalatvam’- Rupa Goswami says in NOD. Pure devotees don’t waste their time, they always are cautious to make sure they are always engaged positively in K.C.
(4) preksanam- Don’t look lustfully at the opposite sex. Focus your eyes (or remember) on your favorite deity form of the Lord.
(5) guhyabhasanam- Don’t talk intimately with the opposite sex in a secluded place. Make strong friendships with other brahmacari’s, (or offer your choice prayerful words to the deity instead).
(6) sankalpo- Don’t decide to engage in sexual intercourse. Make sure you get proper counseling with a senior devotee(s) you have implicit trust in, if you have fallen to this bad state of mind. (Thinking, feeling, willing).
(7) adhyavasayas- Don’t endeavor for sex life. Endeavor to improve or get better devotees association then you have now.
(8) ca kriyanirvrttir - Don’t engage in sex life. Doing it has more trouble in store for you (health, and otherwise) then you think. Control the senses, mind, activities by devotional service.
nirvrttir eva ca - One executes real brahmacarya when all these activities come to a halt. (Sridhara 6.1.12).
Artificial or Natural ?
Hare Krishna. This is amazing. You have provided A-Z of what should be avoided and you have also provided solutions for all of them. However should I wait for chanting to give me love for God so that it becomes easier for me to follow the solutions or should I artificially control the mind ?
ONS.
Control of mind
Haribol. If we all have to wait till our chanting becomes perfect, then none of us can follow any rules. It is not a question to artificially control the mind. Because that would result in repeated failure. The desire is there in all of us. The way is to purify the desire. Our love for Krishna is reflected here as lust for material things. When we chant and hear about Krishna, and associate with devotees, we revive our love for Krishna and be situated in our original and natural position. When we stop chanting or engaging in Krishna consciousness, the desire is again going to show up.
The rules given by Sridhara Swami need to be practiced rigorously. And it becomes somewhat easy to practice in the company of devotees. Being alone and trying to practice it may seem like artificially controlling the mind. So the panacea is to be determined and practice in the association of great souls. And we can also use all the help we can get otherwise - by controlling our diet, avoiding the company of opposite sex when not absolutely required and so on. To control the mind Krishna recommends 2 things - repeated practice and detachment. Again this becomes easy only in the association of devotees.
Radhikesh das
And your Wife?
What is recommended regarding sexual engagement with your spouse? Should it be done passionately as worship if she insists?
To Anonymous
How come your Profile is not Visible?
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Profile
I have not made a profile. Thanks.
Now there
Now I have made a profile. Ok?
What is recommended
What is recommended regarding sexual engagement with a spouse?
is it to possible to leave
is it to possible to leave addiction regarding porn and masturbating even after a very long time......???? i feel embarassed to ask this but i have no other option. what should i do.....i am a beginner in KC.
Start at the top
Start reading at the top of this page then see if you have any questions.
Are you chanting japa
Hare Krishna
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Yes Prabhu ji, i have been
Yes Prabhu ji, i have been chanting for atleast 6 months now, but because i keep falling down quite often that gives me a lot of guilt because of which i have never been determined to stay on this path.
it sounds like
It sounds like you have put a lot of effort into training yourself to be this way. Now you have to put some effort into training yourself in a better way. In short, the way to detach from the material modes of nature is to attach yourself to the feet of Lord Krishna. You need to pray and make a plan. You need to have something to do instead of what you are doing.
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Visit the Food Channel @ Krishna.com
thank you prabhu ji, i ll
thank you prabhu ji, i ll surely apply your suggestion.